13:39:45 From  Ted Manning  to  Everyone:
	Put your questions and interventions here.

13:44:47 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	Even if we could achieve 100% material recycling we would have to double material input if the scale of  world economic activity doubles.  So, is material economic growth the enemy of the circular economy?  (Keep in mind that material consumption has expanded most rapidly during the period of greatest efficiency gains.)

13:48:43 From  Thorhaug Anitra  to  Everyone:
	The FAO Forestry in 2021 says that 85% of the forests are degraded.  The major ecosystems in the marine point to about 50% degraded.  So, this has become critical.

13:53:35 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	Under the power of exponential growth, as much damage will be done during the next doubling of the human material economy as the sum of damage done by all previous doublings since the beginning of exponential growth ~220 years ago.  Example: more than half of all fossil fuel consumption has occurred since ~1990, i.e., in the past 30-35 years.  Can growth continue without destroying the ecosphere?

13:55:07 From  Thorhaug Anitra  to  Everyone:
	No, growth cannot continue or we will destroy the underlying ecosystems giving us oxygen, water retention, and many of our food products found within ecosystems.

13:57:34 From  Art Hunter  to  Everyone:
	If humanity can't do some substantial population controls, nature will conduct a massive population correction.

13:57:43 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	Given exponential law, a finite planet, and the fact that we are already in overshoot, are the projections of increased material use you have shown us even theoretically possible?

13:58:26 From  Herbert Girardet  to  Everyone:
	China has also increased its meat consumption tenfold over the last 40 years, catching up with per capita figures in Europe and the US.  Much of China's meat production now draws on Amazonian soybeans.

14:00:19 From  Susan Tanner  to  Everyone:
	We are going so fast in the wrong direction it seems like a fatal accident is unavoidable.  How to change the mindset of predatory capitalism?  The Indigenous perspective of respecting and sharing with the natural world is so desperately needed.

14:00:25 From  Thorhaug Anitra  to  Everyone:
	Really difficult situation that best lands in mnay nations with real hunger problems is owned or given for export of food products to China, Japan, Australia, and Western Europe and North America.  These people in the poorest nations need their own food nutritional products.

14:01:07 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	100% recycling is never possible.  100% of energy inputs are irretrievably lost (energy can be used only once) and there is always some material waste in recycling matter (2nd Law of Thermodynamics).

14:04:03 From  Thorhaug Anitra  to  Everyone:
	Where Mamphela, our CoR leader comes from and lives, 10 people (in a 15' by 10' tin hut) live in the "townships."  Today is their independence day for the Apartheid revolution 30 years ago.

14:10:03 From  John McClintock  to  Everyone:
	Do you think that it would be feasible for the Swedish government, for example, to introduce a scheme of 'personal carbon budgets' which gradually fall over the years so that citizens are obliged to reduce their greenhouse gas emissions, in line with the Paris and Glasgow climate goals?

14:10:30 From  Herbert Girardet  to  Everyone:
	We need much more clarity about the systemic difference between technosphere (a production system) and biosphere (a REproduction system).  The biosphere IS 100% circular, the technosphere needs try its best to mimic this.

14:13:02 From  Andrew Welch  to  Everyone:
	So long as *WE* allow a value system which follows exactly the same exponential curves (money) to dominate society (and trump all qualitative values), then (a) those who have the most money will rule absolutely, and (b) all of the curves that he has shown us will continue.  There will be no reductions, and there will be no leadership to drive transformation.
	
	Nature's values do not graph with these curves.

14:15:07 From  John Meyer  to  Everyone:
	Consumption differences between rich and poor need to be discounted for geographic factors (i.e., energy required to maintain survival in warm temperate regions vs northern regions).

14:15:29 From  Mike Nickerson  to  Everyone:
	Your talk of materials and material use.
	
	Do you see a role for cultural change?
	
	A shift from consumption to seeking fulfillment from relating, learning, helping, appreciation, sport, music, and the like?
	
	More Fun, Less Stuff!

14:15:35 From  Peter MacKinnon  to  Everyone:
	What about the future of energy?  For example, the use of small modular reactors (SMRs) as a local heat and electrical source as part of a circular economy.  

14:20:09 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	Keep in mind that the anticipated material growth of everything in low-income countries will all be based on the consumption of virgin energy and materials.  (One cannot recycle something that does not yet exist!)  Is it not clear that both lifestyle expectations must be transformed and populations reduced to achieve 'one-planet living'?

14:20:49 From  Andrew Welch  to  Everyone:
	This is not about meeting human needs.  We had that ability decades ago. This is about redefining human wants.
	
	Our economies and problems are being aggressively driven by NIMPLEs--those who see the problems our speaker references as Not In My Personal Life Expectancy.

14:21:10 From  Peter MacKinnon  to  Everyone:
	Vehicle numbers in cities are anticipated to drop dramatically with the rise of autonomous vehicles.  Moreover, the insurance industry is deeply concerned with this anticipated trend.

14:27:08 From  Zack Jacobson b. 310ppm  to  Everyone:
	I see his as useful for addressing worsening climate change in the future--partially.  Do these schemes address the developing climate chage already baked in and worsening?

14:31:05 From  Peter MacKinnon  to  Everyone:
	Canada introduced the Conserver Society as a step toward a Circular Economy by Environment Canada in the early 1970s, the first national environmental department in the world.  It had a major focus on recycling household materials.  It was the start of what we have in recycling in Canada today.

14:39:54 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	Egregious inequality is a major problem, and  we do have to face the fact of overconsumption in rich countries.  However, right now, population growth is the largest contributor to the growth of human eco-footprints in all income categories.

14:45:23 From  Andrew Welch  to  Everyone:
	His methodologies of circular economies are excellent and totally rational.  Yes, there are better ways of doing everything, including material usage and agriculture.
	
	So, who will bell the cat?  (Indeed who, among those who truly dictate global economic policy, is even motivated to do so?)
	
	The changes demanded, even for the most courageous of political parties, will not survive the first election cycle.
	
	The answer, to my (hysterically optimistic?) mind, is to redefine (as individuals and as societies) which values we choose to lead us.

14:46:41 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	Decoupling is 100% myth based on faulty monetary accounting and a focus on carbon only.  Fact: the human EF is increasing and H. sapiens is the single largest consumer organism--both herbivore and carnivore--in all the world's major ecosystems.  (Which is why the human biomass is increasing and the biomass of other mammals and vertebrates is crashing.)

14:48:11 From  John Hollins  to  Everyone:
	How about rationing?  Worked post WW2.

14:48:27 From  Susan Tanner  to  Everyone:
	We need to move from science to cultural ommunications: art, literature, theatre.

14:48:40 From  Anders Wijkman  to  Everyone:
	anders@wijkman.se

14:56:05 From  Raymond Leury  to  Everyone:
	John's argument does not explain why the average Swede has a much lower carbon footprint than the average Canadian.  There are many other factors, such as taxes on energy, that have a huge influence.

14:57:50 From  Dave Dougherty  to  Everyone:
	The average indigenous person who lived in the Winnipeg areas 200 years ago survived, indeed thrived.  Very low consumption and pollution.

14:58:17 From  Anders Wijkman  to  Everyone:
	Wellbeing Economy Alliance--Finland, Iceland, Wales, Scotland, New Zealand.

15:00:06 From  Andrew Welch  to  Everyone:
	Agreed, Raymond and Dave.  I believe northern hemisphere energy usage is far more influenced by cultural norms, travel habits, and home sizes, not the chilly weather outside.

15:07:31 From  Andrew Welch  to  Everyone:
	Very interesting thoughts on rationing.  It will never be freely voted for, but it may be forced by circumstances.
	
	Perhaps (dare I say it) the Ukrainian War, like the CoViD-19 pandemic, could be the detonator for the kind of societal change that is needed.

15:08:05 From  William Rees  to  Everyone:
	If  we put caps (quotas) on allowable extraction of FF or fish, or wood-fibre, etc.--as is required for sustainability--then rationing will absolutely necessary to ensure that low income nations/people achieve at least sufficiency.

15:09:28 From  Anders Wijkman  to  Everyone:
	Agree with Andrew.  Both the pandemic and the war offer opportunities to rethink a lot of things!!

15:30:34 From  Peter MacKinnon  to  Everyone:
	Must go by 3:30.  Thanks great discussion.  I agree Zoom and YouTube have added a lot to orgs like CACOR and the Foresight Synergy Network at uOttawa.